Jay Greeson: Time gives true grades for hirings

Tennessee head football coach Butch Jones talks with the media as his family, seated back right, look on during a news conference in the Peyton Manning Locker Room Complex at Neyland Stadium Friday, Dec. 7, 2012. (ADAM BRIMER/NEWS SENTINEL)

Photo by Adam Brimer, Knoxville News Sentinel

Tennessee head football coach Butch Jones talks with the media as his family, seated back right, look on during a news conference in the Peyton Manning Locker Room Complex at Neyland Stadium Friday, Dec. 7, 2012. (ADAM BRIMER/NEWS SENTINEL)

Do you believe Butch Jones is the right choice to be UT's coach?

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We almost can close the book on the coach-hiring craziness that was the last 20-plus days across the South. It was a roller coaster that left four Southeastern Conference schools with new coaches and two former successful SEC coaches in new jobs in somewhat shocking locales.

All six of those fan bases are looking around wondering who will fill out the staffs and who will recruit well and on and on and whether these guys are the future or the future buyout.

In the end, the only answer we have as college football fans is hope. We hope these hires turn out. We hope these guys are as good as they say and will do what they say in the introductory news conferences. We hope the feeling-good one-liners and pledges that we long to hear are true and worthy and just.

We hope as each new coach steps to the mic and goes through the mad lib of speeches.

Continue reading at the Times Free Press.

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Comments » 31

albert63 writes:

FIRST -
bUTCH LOST TO THE ONLY 2 RANKED TEAMS HE PLAYED LAST YEAR..HMMM

6972 writes:

His record at UT W 0 / L -0. Let hope the "w" column grows nicely.

OrangePride writes:

OK.....that's it. I have been reading these message boards since CBJ was hired and I just can't stand it. These very same people who have been calling for Dooley's head and a coaching change for two years are now unhappy with a coaching change??? Are you guys kidding me??!! We have a new coach with 4 championships, but now we are critical of the competition, or the league, or the recruiting classes, or whatever? How about this....you guys stop comparing apples to oranges and just shut up for a bit and give this man a chance to put a few teams on the field. You are either a Vol fan and behind this team or you are not.......there's no middle ground here. "Oh, if they win next year I'm there, otherwise I'm on the "firebutchjones.com" site. Tennessee does not need this kind of fan...in fact no team does. Just saying....really tired of it!

KevGoVols1981 writes:

OrangePride, if i may, i would like to say that i agree with you. There is no way to stop the masses from complaining about everything. The reason is because there is no patience with a fanbase whose team is historically dominating. If the trolls want to argue that, tennessee currently sits at 8th all time in wins, with 799. I get the what have you done for me lately thing, but our fairweather fans need to stfu and see what this coach has. He is definitely better than derek dooley. Only time will tell.

gerwmor writes:

I agree with the previous two posts. Maybe some of you people are not happy with what CBJ has done because it was in what you consider a lesser level of competition. OK, it was not the SEC. But UT is not Cincinatti or Western Michigan. If you really belive in UT, then you will realize that now CBJ has the resources to attract the best recruits and produce SEC quality teams. If you don't believe that given what he has done with much less to work with, you are implying you don't believe in UT.

navarrebeachvol writes:

in response to OrangePride:

OK.....that's it. I have been reading these message boards since CBJ was hired and I just can't stand it. These very same people who have been calling for Dooley's head and a coaching change for two years are now unhappy with a coaching change??? Are you guys kidding me??!! We have a new coach with 4 championships, but now we are critical of the competition, or the league, or the recruiting classes, or whatever? How about this....you guys stop comparing apples to oranges and just shut up for a bit and give this man a chance to put a few teams on the field. You are either a Vol fan and behind this team or you are not.......there's no middle ground here. "Oh, if they win next year I'm there, otherwise I'm on the "firebutchjones.com" site. Tennessee does not need this kind of fan...in fact no team does. Just saying....really tired of it!

+1

VolunteerLifer writes:

Greeson's theory is that since Fulmer coached here ten years, a 'natural' attrition in public support did him in. Had nothing to do with the fact that his program had been in a downward spiral for the last five of his fifteen years.

According to Greeson, that was just part of natural ups and downs of coaching. Of course, this is just a sportswriter fantasy. We fans know that Fulmer was fired because he got fat, lazy, and complacent. His recruiting went to hell, and he couldn't recover when he realized he was in hot water. The only reason he lasted as long as he did was because his earlier successes gave him a cache and a reputation that he mooched on for about four years too many.

OrangePsyched writes:

in response to navarrebeachvol:

+1

+2

RealisticVol writes:

in response to OrangePride:

OK.....that's it. I have been reading these message boards since CBJ was hired and I just can't stand it. These very same people who have been calling for Dooley's head and a coaching change for two years are now unhappy with a coaching change??? Are you guys kidding me??!! We have a new coach with 4 championships, but now we are critical of the competition, or the league, or the recruiting classes, or whatever? How about this....you guys stop comparing apples to oranges and just shut up for a bit and give this man a chance to put a few teams on the field. You are either a Vol fan and behind this team or you are not.......there's no middle ground here. "Oh, if they win next year I'm there, otherwise I'm on the "firebutchjones.com" site. Tennessee does not need this kind of fan...in fact no team does. Just saying....really tired of it!

Agreed!

edee writes:

Sounds like according to my paper the best coaching staff in the nation comes from OHIO? Really???????????????????

HooRay_Vol writes:

Tee Martin turns down Butch Jones. Sad that he doesn't want to be closer to his first son......

6972 writes:

Some have written BJ off already. Seems to me Abraham Lincoln lost an election before he became one of the great presidents of the USA. We have a memorial in his honor in DC today.
Why don't we BJ some time to prove himself. We do the same for our children.

wireless_vol writes:

in response to navarrebeachvol:

+1

+2

PUL4VOLS writes:

We just have to wait and see. The same ones who jumped on the nega-bandwagon from the firing of Fulmer will be back in force. That is especially so if the the first year is rocky and it could be with the schedule. We shall know about the new staff and recruiting soon enough and then go from there. A new day dawns Vol fans. Will we embrace it?

VolGrad writes:

in response to OrangePride:

OK.....that's it. I have been reading these message boards since CBJ was hired and I just can't stand it. These very same people who have been calling for Dooley's head and a coaching change for two years are now unhappy with a coaching change??? Are you guys kidding me??!! We have a new coach with 4 championships, but now we are critical of the competition, or the league, or the recruiting classes, or whatever? How about this....you guys stop comparing apples to oranges and just shut up for a bit and give this man a chance to put a few teams on the field. You are either a Vol fan and behind this team or you are not.......there's no middle ground here. "Oh, if they win next year I'm there, otherwise I'm on the "firebutchjones.com" site. Tennessee does not need this kind of fan...in fact no team does. Just saying....really tired of it!

Aw, take it easy on them. They're feeling really low because Gruden rejected their flirts. Perfectly understandable.8-]

6972 writes:

in response to HooRay_Vol:

Tee Martin turns down Butch Jones. Sad that he doesn't want to be closer to his first son......

Blood is thicker than water, and sometimes money/and or opportunity is thicker than blood.
All depends on priorities I guess.

orangecountyvols writes:

Vols,

A nice change of pace. Quite a few intelligent comments from you Vols. I'll remember your names........your posts are those worth reading.

VolGrad writes:

This first states the obvious [time will tell], but then it draws conclusions based on an oversimplification of the dynamics.

As I recall, CPF's only detractors initially were those that thought he had stabbed CJM in the back, stolen the job from him. Those detractors were never won over despite CPF's initial 7 years and NC victory. So that blows his conclusion about winning being the "ultimate converter" at least somewhat.

The other dynamic was the expectation level of everyone, including the fans, rose with that increased level of success. I remember playing as an underdog- feeling like we always had a chip on our shoulder, like no one in the media ever gave us a chance. Then that all changed, at least in part, due to the success of those early years of CPF's tenure. But the wheels started coming off long before his 10th year, Mr. Greeson. They started coming off in the NC game itself. That was about the sloppiest and most inconsistent we had played all year (first game vs Syracuse was possibly sloppier) offensively. Credit FSU's defense with some of it. Credit the absence of Cutcliffe with the rest. CPF never found a fitting replacement. The offense suffered. Execution failed. Point production went down significantly. And the defense came under increasing scrutiny as a result.

Few people had any problems with our defense or the DC until then. Offensive failures noted above and turnovers increased. The pressure was increased on the defense, and it imploded at times. It still had its moments but few of us remember those. When we were scoring 30-38 pts per game, it was a non-issue and happened less frequently. But in the years post Cutcliffe, every single mistake or breakdown defensively put the game in jeopardy.

This is not mere theory. CDC's two year return is proof of what his presence meant to both sides of the ball as well as the win totals. Because CPF, leader of a team that had won several SEC titles and an NC, could not effectively replace his OC..., that, is what did him in.

Some say CPF got lazy. I find that hard to believe, but it is irrelevant. He consistently failed to meet expectations. He and CDC had set some pretty lofty ones after those first 7 years. CPF's hiring of Clawson and a scheme that would take a couple of years to implement was much like CDD's hiring of Sunseri and the 3-4 known to take at least that long to learn. Neither had that much time. But at least with CPF, he figured he'd earned the time. Well, the AD (and many fans) didn't agree.

Thus, Greeson is right about one thing for sure. It is a cutthroat league. Of course, that is a negative way to express it. You could just say that it is a very "competitive" league.

Which now brings us back full circle to the obvious statement with which we began: time will tell how CBJ's tenure will turn out. And most of us as fans certainly are hoping and praying for the best.

This is Big Orange Country!!!

Scottallen6691#1412403 writes:

I have a feeling Tennessee did good on its new hire, think about it, when he came to Cinn. the senior class had graduated, so he lost some in his first year but the next year he began to win and to win big, he has the mind set of a winner, he thinks it eats it and walks it, you can see it, and that catches on, those guys do everything it takes to win,

Scottallen6691#1412403 writes:

in response to Scottallen6691#1412403:

I have a feeling Tennessee did good on its new hire, think about it, when he came to Cinn. the senior class had graduated, so he lost some in his first year but the next year he began to win and to win big, he has the mind set of a winner, he thinks it eats it and walks it, you can see it, and that catches on, those guys do everything it takes to win,

thing I notice about Jones he has that , Iam a hit man fixin to do a hit on Joey the snake look on him... he has that kill look and thats needed , Iam going to win no matter what,

Colliervol writes:

in response to Scottallen6691#1412403:

thing I notice about Jones he has that , Iam a hit man fixin to do a hit on Joey the snake look on him... he has that kill look and thats needed , Iam going to win no matter what,

I know one thing. I'll bet his quarterbacks won't be coming off the field yelling and rolling their eyes at him. Or blowing him off when Butch wants to have a chat with him on the sideline.

luke255#536431 writes:

I'm not thrilled about Butch hire wish we would have gotten Petrino. But I'm a big boy and will give him Jones a chance. The one thing I do know is as awful a coach as Dooley was we can only go up!

AHOUSE writes:

in response to wireless_vol:

+2

+ 3 any more? any more?! + 4? Let's go Vols!

LIBDESTROYER writes:

All we are say--ing, is "give Butch a chance."

Vol_in_Mich writes:

in response to OrangePride:

OK.....that's it. I have been reading these message boards since CBJ was hired and I just can't stand it. These very same people who have been calling for Dooley's head and a coaching change for two years are now unhappy with a coaching change??? Are you guys kidding me??!! We have a new coach with 4 championships, but now we are critical of the competition, or the league, or the recruiting classes, or whatever? How about this....you guys stop comparing apples to oranges and just shut up for a bit and give this man a chance to put a few teams on the field. You are either a Vol fan and behind this team or you are not.......there's no middle ground here. "Oh, if they win next year I'm there, otherwise I'm on the "firebutchjones.com" site. Tennessee does not need this kind of fan...in fact no team does. Just saying....really tired of it!

Some can or will not get over the fact Fulmer was let go. They will never be happy unless he's hired back & I'm not sure that would even do it.
Kiffin didn't work out. Dooley was a huge mistake. Butch is a winner, he may not be a mistake, but even if he wins the East next year you will hear the Fulmerites yelling "not good enough, Phil would've won the NC"
Like you, I'm getting tired of this bull, it's not just here, they are on the other VOL boards as well.
As a fan told me the other day, it's not all Vol fans, just some of these keyboard commandos who are this way. I hope that's true.

Give em heII Butch!

Vol_in_Mich writes:

in response to VolGrad:

This first states the obvious [time will tell], but then it draws conclusions based on an oversimplification of the dynamics.

As I recall, CPF's only detractors initially were those that thought he had stabbed CJM in the back, stolen the job from him. Those detractors were never won over despite CPF's initial 7 years and NC victory. So that blows his conclusion about winning being the "ultimate converter" at least somewhat.

The other dynamic was the expectation level of everyone, including the fans, rose with that increased level of success. I remember playing as an underdog- feeling like we always had a chip on our shoulder, like no one in the media ever gave us a chance. Then that all changed, at least in part, due to the success of those early years of CPF's tenure. But the wheels started coming off long before his 10th year, Mr. Greeson. They started coming off in the NC game itself. That was about the sloppiest and most inconsistent we had played all year (first game vs Syracuse was possibly sloppier) offensively. Credit FSU's defense with some of it. Credit the absence of Cutcliffe with the rest. CPF never found a fitting replacement. The offense suffered. Execution failed. Point production went down significantly. And the defense came under increasing scrutiny as a result.

Few people had any problems with our defense or the DC until then. Offensive failures noted above and turnovers increased. The pressure was increased on the defense, and it imploded at times. It still had its moments but few of us remember those. When we were scoring 30-38 pts per game, it was a non-issue and happened less frequently. But in the years post Cutcliffe, every single mistake or breakdown defensively put the game in jeopardy.

This is not mere theory. CDC's two year return is proof of what his presence meant to both sides of the ball as well as the win totals. Because CPF, leader of a team that had won several SEC titles and an NC, could not effectively replace his OC..., that, is what did him in.

Some say CPF got lazy. I find that hard to believe, but it is irrelevant. He consistently failed to meet expectations. He and CDC had set some pretty lofty ones after those first 7 years. CPF's hiring of Clawson and a scheme that would take a couple of years to implement was much like CDD's hiring of Sunseri and the 3-4 known to take at least that long to learn. Neither had that much time. But at least with CPF, he figured he'd earned the time. Well, the AD (and many fans) didn't agree.

Thus, Greeson is right about one thing for sure. It is a cutthroat league. Of course, that is a negative way to express it. You could just say that it is a very "competitive" league.

Which now brings us back full circle to the obvious statement with which we began: time will tell how CBJ's tenure will turn out. And most of us as fans certainly are hoping and praying for the best.

This is Big Orange Country!!!

Wow, there IS intelligent life on here after all. Excellent post Grad.

JonGrudensAgent writes:

Not sure of the point to this story, win or go home?

Jones has put together a staff with some SEC flavor at least. Too bad it has been with guys that weren't good enough for Richt to get over the hump and win a title with or help Chizik make it without Cam Newton.

I see a glorious return to the days of 7-5 and 8-4 and 3rd or 4th in the SEC East. Well played Alabama Dave.

SCVFL writes:

in response to wireless_vol:

+2

+3

LCPanthers (Inactive) writes:

in response to luke255#536431:

I'm not thrilled about Butch hire wish we would have gotten Petrino. But I'm a big boy and will give him Jones a chance. The one thing I do know is as awful a coach as Dooley was we can only go up!

Agreed I wish Petrino and Tuberville would have been considered.

TKG_VOL writes:

As all of you well know, you cant have a winning program in this league ,SEC, with 2 and 3 star recruits. It takes a slew of 4 star and a couple of big time game changing, wanna be at TENNESSEE, 5 star recruits every year to stay competitive every year. Recruiting is where it all starts. CBJ needs to get the big boys from TN to stay at home and of course we are going to have to recruit well nationally and especially out of Ga. Fla. and the Carolinas as we use to do, BUT, a couch can't twist these recruits arms and hold a gun to their heads to get them to sign if they dont want to come to TN. It will take winning to get TN back on the big time national map so these top recruits can see they can meet their potential with excellent coaches, and be ready for the pros in 3 to 4 years. This will take some time for CBJ to establish a good foot hold in recruiting with Ala. LSU. Geo. and even TA&M now out of Texas. Then when you get these caliber of players they will need coaching up OF COURSE. No more tip toeing around your star players, get tough with them. If the heat of the SEC is too hot then get out of the kitchen. I think CBJ appears to have this attitude and will have UT competitive again in a couple of years and playing for SEC championships again soon. It all starts with recruiting though. GO BIG ORANGE. GO CBJ, get ur done.

HighPlainsVol writes:

Coach Jones is going to be like Doug Dickey, not Derek Dooley.

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